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Important, some change happened

  01/17/19 12:54, by Celeste

So as the class discussed I am posting a Standard change. As we went along in the class our Standards changed and what happened was instead of what we originally intended to do, which was rating all projects, and projects that had an average of above 5 would be presented to the class we all made the decision to just have every person in the class present at least one of their projects. This was done because some of the projects were the kind where people didn't need to explain it in a presentation, it was self explanatory and that had been done on the Blog. This happened and no one thought to look at the Standards. 

Because of this as a group agreement we are saying that this is true, "you" as a person in the class have to present at least one project for the class, as well as rating ALL of the projects everyone has done. This must be done by: Friday Jan 18 by 8:00am and if not you will not receive credit for this class. 

On that note please double check that you have commented your rating for each project of everyone's that was posted by this deadline. 


Comment from: [Member]

Thank you for taking the time to post this Celeste!

01/17/19 @ 14:02
Comment from: [Member]

No problem, at this point we need everyone on the same page.

01/17/19 @ 14:52
Comment from: [Member]

Thanks Celeste!

01/17/19 @ 15:00
Comment from: [Member]

Certainly this is not the plan! Tell me no….

If the whole class cannot acknowledge that the presentations are more important than the laughable “evaluations” that class members will be doing, the whole class has learned nothing from this class’ failure(s)

Mindless busy-work KILLS passion, mocks quality, creates apathy, ensures boredom — need I continue (or are I alone in this horror….could be…..??)

Each member of this class (including myself indeed and excepting Dylan) — must acknowledge our own individual failure(s) - personal AND group failings — in a straightforward way. If everybody seeks to Pass without reflection — or worse, Pass by typing 9/10 multiple times on scattered, cursory, dilatory summaries of rushed projects — any positives of this class (and this school!) are lost (if not mocked….). An average grade — so far — of 9.3 literally mocks those excellent projects and participants.

Many projects are excellent, creative, fun, thoughtful and deserve class attention but more are poor and deserve honest evaluation (by both individuals and the class). The summaries provide little to grade honestly — this is a good idea failed, we must recognize — so why slog on ?

Can we not agree that at this juncture (literally after the class has ended) energy spent in reflection is far more productive and positive then following/chasing the track of good idea (the class’ grading and presenting) when that train has left the station weeks ago. (Note one of the objective standards the class agreed to was “timely “ completion of these projects — only three students had any sense of timely!! — for timeliness alone every member of this class (except Dylan) deserves censure at least, or, deserves “No Credit.”

Own your education fully people or do me a favor and tell me to turn around and mind my own business.

01/17/19 @ 15:04
Comment from: [Member]

Thanks Celeste

01/17/19 @ 15:05
Comment from: [Member]

I think these standards should be enough to get a low pass. Even though I acknowledge that the class was an overall failure, some people still worked hard on their projects.

01/17/19 @ 18:02
Comment from: [Member]

John, if the presentations are very important, is there a time we could present to each other? A resource is not enough time people are saying and the last day of the semester is tomorrow…

I don’t know if I deserve it or many people, but I don’t think I am just speaking for myself when I say I would like credit for this class and will do anything I can to earn it.


01/17/19 @ 18:09
Comment from: [Member]

Remember Rowan (and others) — we agreed to push Personal Finance and Probability and Statistics — two half credit classes EACH into a half credit block time (two days a week for the semester.

We failed. Class members had to do twice as much per class instead our Probability and Stats class saw an 18 percent attendance and next to no timely out of classwork.

It seems fair — given that only 5 people have passed Personal Finance — that class members should chose one for a half credit and take the other again when appropriate attention can be paid.

For example, for those students who care about their projects or care about learning from each other’s projects, the easiest solution is to have project prensentations throughout next semester for this purpose.

If you — or others (like Isaac, whose comment about Low Pass explicitly enjoins)— do not care about the class or honoring classmates proudly applied energy, why are we having this conversation?

01/17/19 @ 18:28
Comment from: [Member]

Ok. I understand thank you

Oh also, you did see and approve both of my assignments for personal finance. You said that my budget was “excellent”. You saw but did not sign my exam, can I show it to you still or is it too late? I was under the impression that you said “show it to me if you think it is worthy” I did not know you had to sign it.

01/17/19 @ 18:59
Comment from: [Member]

I realize this class has failed. I agree fully with Isaacs post and ideas.

01/17/19 @ 19:12
Comment from: [Member]

When, Rowan, will you (and Isaac) look forward to doing work you are proud of filling instead of looking in the review mirror as you back into low pass standards and apologies for yourself when you invariably hit these standards squarely?

I look forward to this assignment or to this class or to this you!

01/17/19 @ 21:06
Comment from: [Member]


It was originally up to us to show you if we thought it was good enough for you to see. Now you need to have seen it in order for us to pass.
I think the main problem here is lack of clarity.

I do not think my exam answers were bad. I just did not think they were good enough to show you, and potentially waste your time.

It does make complete sense though that we should have to show you in order to pass. The fact that it seemed optional was a severe problem, I think.

Rowan said he DID show you.

I think the main failure of statistics was the fact that we (the class) were aloud, required even, to make the standards. The presentation side of things was poorly thought up, and it was somehow agreed that we only needed to do ‘at least one presentation’ even though it was written in the standards in such a way that made it quite apparent that we needed to present all of them.

01/17/19 @ 21:51
Comment from: [Member]

Some thought onto what Tangwyn said. I think that we definitely could have gone over the Standards after the break to make sure that we were all on the same page, and this did not happen.

I feel like these were either in some areas to specific and in others not specific enough.

The situation that we are in right now is tough, for me personally I put in time and effort into all of the projects I did. In every project I did it on something that I was interested in or passionate about. I feel like right now that work some how isn’t being worth what it deserves.

I fully agree that this class was at the bottom, but what needs to happen now? Something?

I know that everyone needs to take a Probs and Stats at one or another. This causes a problem because the environment in the class is not the best. Working around this is hard, we have to find some way to make the class enjoyable and yet learn everything that is the required material.

Going forward we need to make a decision of what is to happen. Some of the possibilities could include going forward and not getting credit for this class, (which I don’t think anyone wants that to happen) or to figure some way to deal with the Standards, and our time that we spent learning this past Quarter.

This class should not have been a waist.

01/17/19 @ 22:29
Comment from: [Member]

So much to address in you comment Tangwyn but allow me to stick to clarity.

I am not your (or Rowan’s) teacher. I work ONLY with students who have interest in a subject or interest to improve a skill.

If you are interested in “Passing” (in this case Personal Finance) I would (have) been happy to recommend passing to anybody who gave me their Examination to read/evaluate.

If you (or Rowan or any body else) created an examination that you are too embarrassed to show me, how can l (could I) be involved in recommending you to “Pass”? The gulf between doing proud and meaningful work is a large one, because you do not do meaningful and proud work does not mean you cannot/should not Pass, it merely means I should not be involved in Passing you (this is a lonely decision every student — especially students not aiming at proud and meaningful work — should be forced to make for themselves “Do I Pass?”
(If a student do does not want the enormity of this decision they should find a class or teacher that will pass them…)

I can (could have) helped you be proud of your examination if this was your priority to improve but, if you are willing to pass yourself with embarrassing work why am I involved?

l can help any student who wants to do good, proud, meaningful work achieve this goal but if a student wants to do only the work necessary to Pass, I’m not involved.

01/18/19 @ 06:50
Comment from: [Member]

Maybe I have not been very specific, for me personally I have had you, John look at my work throughout this class, and the Personal Finance class. I have had my Final Examination looked at and I am assuming, approved.

I am only looking for some clarity of what the next step is for class. This is the main problem that we are having right now.

I care about what happens next, and I do care about the time and effort I put into all of my projects.

01/18/19 @ 08:52
Comment from: [Member]

I am proud of my work I did on my final exam and especially my budget. And with that i would like credit for them.

01/18/19 @ 14:03

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